PESHAWAR, Nov 24: Pakistan and Afghanistan are actively engaged in firming up ideas to hold jirgas to contain violence and bring stability to the volatile tribal region straddling their borders.

Background interviews with government officials associated with the consultation process currently being carried out in Pakistan revealed that an internal meeting was held at the foreign office last week to discuss the holding of the proposed jirgas on both sides of the border.

These discussions on jirgas are a follow-up to an agreement reached between President Pervez Musharraf and his Afghan counterpart Hamid Karzai at a dinner at the White House hosted by President Bush on September 27, an official said.

Foreign Office spokesperson Tasnim Aslam acknowledged that the meeting took place on November 18 "to hold threadbare discussions on ideas", but said that things would take shape when Foreign Minister Khurshid Mehmood Kasuri met his Afghan counterpart Rangin Dadfar Spanta early next month. The meeting is scheduled in Kabul on Dec 7.

Mr Aslam described last week’s meeting at the Foreign Office as an internal exercise, but declined to give details. She said it remained to be decided what shape the jirgas would take and what modalities needed to be worked out.

"Naturally, we have some ideas. Jirga is not a new concept. But what shape will it take, its modalities and timeline will all be discussed when our foreign minister meets his counterpart next month", she told Dawn on telephone from Islamabad.

The Foreign Office meeting came after Afghanistan handed over what in diplomatic parlance is called a non-paper to Pakistan through the United Nations Assistance Mission in Afghanistan.

The paper, a copy of which is available with Dawn, outlines ‘tentatively’ the size and composition of the Afghan Jirga slated to be held towards the end of 2006, either in Jalalabad or Kandahar with Kabul also being discussed as a possible option.

The Afghan Jirga comprising 180 to 200 participants would include speakers and vice-speakers of the two houses of parliament, chairs of Wolasi jirga commissions, chairs of Masharano jirga commissions, chairs of provincial councils, members of the Ulema Council of Afghanistan and two respected elders or representatives from each of the 34 provinces.

Over a hundred parliamentarians representatives of political and women’s organisations or civil society from across Afghanistan would also be part of the unusually-large jirga that the Afghans believe would generate structured discussions and decisions "to end terrorism as a major factor fuelling insecurity in the region", the document said.

In addition, the Afghan president and two vice-presidents would also attend the jirga, beside 25 members of the cabinet who would attend the proceedings as observers.

The document said that President Karzai also intended to invite President Musharraf and members of the Pakistani Jirga though it has not been yet decided whether the two presidents would preside over the jirga or participate as observers.

Pakistan is yet to decide the size and composition of its own tribal jirga but officials with knowledge and experience believed the Afghan model appeared to be more like a seminar or a road-show than a serious attempt at bringing violence to an end.

"This is not how jirgas are formed and held. This looks more like a seminar where issues are debated and resolutions are adopted to appeal to the good sense of the people to stop violence," said one senior government official who requested not to be named.

There is a degree of cynicism and suspicion that the Afghans might use the platform for "point-scoring" against Pakistan by blaming its tribal borderland for the spiralling violence in south and south-eastern Afghanistan.

Traditionally, government officials say, jirgas are mandated to sort out a particular problem or issue and given the `waak' or authority to take a decision binding on all parties.

"Whether the jirgas will have the waak to decide matters on its own, whether the United States and Nato would be willing to give such an authority and endorse the jirga decisions? These are the questions that need to be thrashed out before a jirga actually starts its proceedings," the official said.

One official wondered whether the Jirga would be allowed to speak to the insurgents as arbitrators to find a solution to growing violence in Afghanistan.

Pakistan has been peddling the North Waziristan peace agreement as a possible model for bringing peace to Afghanistan; though critics of the September 5 truce say it has been signed with militants and not with tribal elders as the government claims.

The officials say that a jirga should either include equal representatives from all sides or should include well respected and independent people acceptable to win the trust of the opposing sides.

"You see this very essential point missing from the Afghan composition," one of the officials said.

A government official, with knowledge of the discussions taking place in Islamabad, said Pakistan was more likely to push for a jirga that would include representatives of the common tribes or sub-tribes living on both sides of the border. These tribes have what is called easement rights to move freely across the border.

The official said that the preferred way would be to narrow down the size and composition of the jirga to people and areas actually affected by violence and terrorism.

He said that the government should encourage small-scale jirgas in each of the provinces and districts most affected by violence to ensure peace and security and deny their "khaora" or soil to subversive elements.

"Unless that happens, any hope that the jirgas as proposed by Afghanistan would bring an end to violence is just a wishful thinking," the official remarked.