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Toronto-based Taimoor Farouk shares tales from the Pakistani diaspora.
The other day, I visited my parents’ long lost friends who had fled Pakistan in the mid-1980s and settled in Canada to secure a good future for their children. Their house, situated in a posh locality of the Greater Toronto area, was nothing less than a mansion, smelling of fresh paint and money.
At the dinner table, their youngest daughter, who seemed fascinated by the idea of getting married and settling in Pakistan, asked whether I was going to look for work in Canada after graduating. The question, however, was cut short by her mother’s question: ‘Or are you also one of those spoilt Pakistanis who live off their parents money and then rush back once the ‘fun’ of foreign education is over?’
‘No, not at all,’ I immediately replied, somewhat sympathising with the middle-aged woman. I could relate to my hostess’s concern because, like her, I also feel that the ways of the youth reflect the socio-economic trends of the nation they hail from.
In Canada, a majority of the Pakistani students that I have interacted with either belong to well-off families or have been raised to be aware of the importance given to ‘foreign’ educated people in their home country. Since most of them are financially dependent on their parents, they feel little or no need to support themselves by working through their university years.
However, by the time these students graduate with little or no job experience and finally realize that it’s a competitive world out there, none of the employers they approach are willing to call them for an interview. From what I have observed, this issue seems to have affected Pakistani-Canadians much more than the Indian expatriates, or even Bangladeshis for that matter. While speaking to a Bangladeshi friend about the same, he mentioned that alongside studying at one of the best business schools in Canada, he had taken up two part-time jobs to support himself. I asked whether his parents were also supporting him, to which he replied: ‘They were. But only until the end of the first year of university.’
Even though, Prime Minister Yousaf Raza Gillani recently spoke of assisting Pakistanis with the integration process in Canada’s multicultural society, it is necessary that the socio-economic trends in Pakistan are dealt with first – reviewing them might resolve some of the problems of expatriates. Family businesses should benefit from professionalism and corporate governance, a strong work ethic should be instilled in the next generation of affluent families, and society as a whole should become less accepting of youngsters who live off their parents indefinitely.
Whether one blames the colonised mindset of the people of Pakistan or simply the lack of ambition to succeed in today’s globalized world, it is evident that the days when one could do well without being too career focused are gone.
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On DawnNews
Comments (56) Closed
May 04, 2009 11:56am
i am an indian and a great fan of dawn.com(yeah even if its pakistani i am not ashamed to say that being an indian, its far better than some of indian and western news channels), but this article was unnecessary. we indians do the same, if we are well to do and in any case the sample taken by the pakistani writer is highly skewed.. u cant judge the whole diaspora with a few people u know...
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May 04, 2009 11:46am
That fact that many Pakistanis are not called to the interview may not be simply down to their lack of work as students.I am not denying the author his view that there are people who do not work and its because they are affluent...but there are also those who work.
Recently in Wales, a Pakistani professional sent his C.V. under two names...one his own and the other under a false British name...the British name got the job interview call but the actual name was turned down..the man sued in court and rightly so...racism,discrimination..these things exist...in every society and do play a part...
Like an British Doctor of Indian descent told me here..."we have to work twice as hard as them and then hope we get lucky"....
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May 04, 2009 11:42am
This observation almost certainly does not apply to Pakistanis settled in the US. One would be hard pressed to find any Pakistani family in which the young adults are intending to return to Pakistan after completion of their studies. On the contrary, almost every professional family can claim at least one child who has gone to an elite Ivy League or comparable school.
The observations by the blogger definitely pertain to a particular group of people possibly from feudal backgrounds whose values were warped to start with.
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May 04, 2009 07:26am
This surprising. I am an Indian living in the US and recently graduated from a university in California, US. I worked part time through university and was even able to get quite a few interviews for techie jobs. I have heard of several Pakistani students also getting several job interviews. But the comparison with Indian expatriates is not entirely correct. There is a different between a rich Indian (or rather South Asian - we ain't too different :) ) and a middle class South Asian. Most Indians here as students are middle class and come from families who do not own businesses. So they have to fend for themselves. I have Indian friends who are from rich families and they are here just for the fun of having flashy cars and a foreign education. Also, I do not see anything wrong in that. If you have it, flaunt it.
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May 04, 2009 07:56am
Can't say I agree with the author's view. Firstly, working through your university years would hardly give you the substantive experience that could be even remotely beneficial when applying for jobs in competitive industries. Lets face it, what would kind of work could the average university student possibly hope of securing? Apart from the obvious McJob, i'm guessing, at best, some mundane clerical/administrative work? Add to that the issue of student visa work restrictions and its no surprise that many students, whose parents can afford the soaring costs of a foreign education, choose NOT to do some dead-end-run-of-the-mill job while they're at it. Besides, I can speak from experience. I HAVE done my share of typical student jobs. Was it to gain experience so I could be a better candidate for that solicitor opening? No.
Secondly, I imagine that the real reason why many job seekers, Pakistanis included, are not having much success lately is because of widespread hiring freezes.
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May 04, 2009 08:32am
As a nation we are not used to hard work ... the generation which was raised on money earned through unfair means is now at the helm of affairs and their next generation is the one which is highlighted in this blog ... so with easy money sent by their daddys back home, this group is totally unaware of toiling to achieve something ...
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May 04, 2009 08:48am
This blog post is anecdotal and not based on empirical data. I went to a premier American University, supported myself through College(including washing dishes in cafeteria) and worked for 12 years in US, before moving to Pakistan. I now run one of the most profitable IT companies in Pakistan, which I bootstrapped from zero. I have many many friends with similar stories.
"From what I have observed" as the author mentions, hardly makes for evidence!
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May 04, 2009 09:02am
Yes! this is absolutely correct that most of the Paksitanis studying abroad are raised by their parents or guardians and while seeking a job, they still look forward towards their parents to support them. In this competitive era, every youngster should mentally prepare himself/herself to raise himself/herself after the age of 20 along with education and start planning to raise their parents and spouse & kids in the near future. Foreign Education is of no use if one fail to get a job. Initially, one has to opt for odd jobs while going through education or starting a career but ultimately, it helps in future once a good experience is gained. Experience about understanding a society, making good contacts and how to work in an environment.
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May 04, 2009 09:12am
I study at McGill University in Canada, and have worked almost 20-25 hours per week from the very start to support myself here. Most of my friends also work part time. I am not sure what is the basic premise of this article - was it written just to fill space?
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May 04, 2009 09:21am
We Indians are hardworking. The whole world is recognizing that today. Even President Obama has said when he was addresssing some students in Washington and I quote "Improve your mathemetics and science otherwise Indian and Chinese will grab your jobs" unquote. Same views were expressed by the President Bush also. That shows the competitiveness of Indians in this world of globalization and our strength lies in our strong domestic education system which is essential for any countries progress. If Pakistanis want to reach to the level of Indians they will first have to improve their domestic education syestem.
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May 04, 2009 09:23am
A well written piece. It is true that Pakistanis don't see the need to work unlike for example Indians who relly work hard to get integrated by working part time alongside their education. It should be the parents who must teach their children the importance to earn their own money and not to depemd on their parents.
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May 04, 2009 09:32am
Good piece of advice to the young ones...but unfortunately, majority of the youngesters going abroad to study end up staying there instead of returning home. So not only they use their parents hard earned resources from Pakistan, they deprive the country of the potential intellect. The job and work experience to support themselves will be useful if they have to face the challenge of seeking jobs in competitive enviornment of Pakistan to maintain their social status. In Canada, the same youngsters will do odd jobs to survive while they refuse to do decent hard work back home.
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May 04, 2009 09:39am
Taimoor is btalking about a certain group of students who had initial education in Pakistan. Children of those pakistanis who had to leave Pakistan for political or religious reason are very diferent and highly competitive. To cite example of one perticular community most of whom came here due to discriminatory laws adopted in Pakistan in 1974. I am told that until middle of 80's they were having their community meetings in rented rooms and now the have largest and most beautiful mosques in whole north America and they have built their own village in north of Toronto. They have acquierd another very large piece of land to establish a city not very far from Toronto and the have similar plans for other provinces. This all is being done with financial contributions from the community members who integrated themselves in their new homeland. One is even more amazed when we see their numbers which is not more than a few thousands.
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May 04, 2009 10:48am
I would agree that many students coming from affluent families do not feel the need to work through or after their time at university. However, this is something that I have observed not only in young, affluent Pakistanis but also in people from countries such as India, China, Switzerlad, etc. I live in the United Kingdom and I've found that young Pakistanis are more likely to work part-time to support themselves through unversity than many other students from other countries.
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May 04, 2009 10:53am
I read with interest Taimoor's article. I completely share his view on the lack of vision in Pakistani students who take admissions in universities abroad. I have interacted with medical and non-medical students in UK who come from Pakistan. The one feature common among them is their affluent family background. These families take pride not in what career their son or daughter will take but are vocal in their social circle that their offsprings are studying abroad. They do not seem to be interested in pursuing any career path, since they are destined to go back either to join politics or enthroned in their family business as manager or chief executive. Very few if any students come to UK from middle class families simply because they would not afford the expenditure. I have seen few of these coming through and within a year ending up doing jobs like taxi driving or standing behind the counters in gas stations. These students tell me that they also have the obligation to send some money back to support their families. Priorities soon change and the studies and career take the back seat. This bunch then never finds its way back to the university campus.
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May 04, 2009 11:02am
I agree with the writer partially because i have seen students from wealthy families whose fees are fully paid by parents still do part time jobs to pay for their lodging & food even if they don't have to. It comes down to person's feeling of responsibility & his desire to be independant.It helps you to acquire language & personal skills by doing these part time jobs.For fresh graduates, its always a challenge to find the first job whethe in Australia or Pakistan. Next steps are easy.New generation is all ambitious except a few who either are not brought up well or born with a silver spoon.
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May 04, 2009 11:09am
I believe it depends whom the writer is mingling with.There may be thousands of Pakistani students in Canada who may be working and not enjoying a free lunch. I think before delving in such a piece one needs to do their homework.
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May 04, 2009 11:16am
I disagree various points, allow me to begin with the point concerning job experience. A precondition to the final year of bachelor education, regardless of field, at universities in Canada is 3 months internship in the most relevant industry. Furthermore I have seen at a well respected bank where I interned that preference has been given to foreign educated Pakistani
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May 04, 2009 11:22am
Reading this commentary, I am immediately reminded of "The Last Nizam", a most fascinating book. After all, any family history provides a dynastic chronicle of sorts. Asaf Jah VII demonstrated that, given enough patrimony, you can simply bulldoze your way through life....
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May 04, 2009 11:36am
Very disappointingc article based on personal but very limkited and superficail observation
1.. Moslty rich students get visa from pakistan
2. They are already spoiled so do not will not and dont have to do those part time jobs
3. Work ethics of whole pakistani nation has gotten worse which they have lerant from their parents.
4. Even in West if the parents are that rich, their kids dont work.
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May 04, 2009 12:01pm
These students are in a age and a social group that has no experience of the harsh realities of present day world.Indeed they have to live a life that is not in sync with their upbringing inside Pakistan.It is not very unusual for many other nationals too.As for there ambitions to work and rise in a free and challenging world ,I would again disagree with the view that Pakistani students lack the desired energy and zest as compared to other nationals. An affording student would like to study with less of work while others do it depeeding on their financial situation.They are not lacking in work ethic either.I think you are a little harsh towards your fellow men.
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May 04, 2009 12:07pm
It was Great Britain where most of Pakistanis first went for higher education and also made their homes abroad. The impression they created about themselves haunts all Pakistanis abroad. No doubt some of them got education and found good jobs, but majority had simply ruined any chance for themselves and those who followed. Still they would blame a society, which was most tolerant in the western world.
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May 04, 2009 12:43pm
Until recently Canadian law (more specifically Ontario law) did not allow international students to work off-campus. These international students had to compete for limited job openings but in most cases were able to secure part time on-campus work like teaching assistants, lab supervisors and research assistants, to name a few. Even now after some recent legal changes international students are still finding hard to get off-campus employment especially in these tough economic times.
Now as far as Canadian Pakistanis are concerned, I haven't in my 8 years in Canada seen them any less hard working than their South Asian counterparts. I have seen Canadian Pakistanis excel in all professional fields and majority if not all of them are hard working, honest and independent individuals from the time they reach high school.
However the community especially the young Pakistanis here in Canada needs to be more involved in activities such as volunteering and political participation. This is really important for the welfare of any immigrant community to guard their interests and improve their image in their adopted country.
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May 04, 2009 12:53pm
I wonder how such an article was published on the Dawn. It generalizes a large sample set with such sparse data that it is certain to be grossly incorrect.
The work ethics of the subcontinent as such may need an awakening however
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May 04, 2009 01:03pm
How can you confuse 1 family with all Expats? Wheres your education basics - you know that 1 family doesn't equal a statistical truth?
Oh and most employers don't give jobs to foriegn students because of the work visa hassles. Its got little to do with racism or 'spoilt' students. A little basic actual knowledge could have answered this question vs. teh poor speculation here. Do you have any idea how much of an hassle it is to hire an expat? In that scenario why hire fresh grad expat when you'd rather use precious resources on someone experienced/more valuable to the company.
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May 04, 2009 01:07pm
This article is vague and based on no facts at all.
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May 04, 2009 01:12pm
How come Farouk is speaking for the diaspora? 95% Pakistanis work. I know qualified doctors and engineers who have done all sorts of odd jobs to give themselves a chance in their new homeland. He should read the book
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May 04, 2009 04:47pm
Good Article .. but this is not just with Pakistanis .. most of the students from other countries also the same....
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May 04, 2009 01:23pm
Doesnt look like the author knows many pakistani students studying in Canada or anywhere else for that matter. Article is based on a very small cross section of students and the observations hold true for students from any country/culture - nothing specific to Pakistanis..Pakistanis do tend to live in their own pakistani groups and dont mingle much - some of us dont drink and consider keeping away from 'foreigners' as way of keeping close to culture/religion; some are probably too narrow minded and some are quite frankly too busy in paying for tuition, food and living !
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May 04, 2009 01:29pm
I am not sure what research the writer conducted to paint all Pakistanis studying abroad with such a wide brush. I studied in USA, so did my sister and brother. We all worked and supported ourselves. So did so many of my fellow Pakistani students who worked two jobs just so that they can get a good education. I knew Indians and Bangladeshis who were hardworking and worked just as hard as any foreign students and some who were supported by their parents. An article based on generalization and personal anecdotes.
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May 04, 2009 01:31pm
I think the mentality needs to change in Pakistan, among the parents who think it is their duty to provide for education and everything in between. I have been in the US for 10 years and initially I felt the same that students should not be bothered by work and other things but just focus on studies and nothing else.
But over a year or so I realized the mental, social and professional developmental opportunities such experiences offer. Average American student has more sense and value for money or any favors they get. They are grateful if you even give them a ride for free or offer lunch, because they learn to appreciate the realities of life at an early age. They mature faster and do not come to work with a sense of entitlement (well I know there is a generational sense of entitlement these days but Desi's and some other foreign folk has much more of it). Ego runs high among Desi's every one is a chaudhry, nizam, nawab or royal descendant. Does anyone care? NO! so Desis have to overcome the desire to feel superior after centuries of oppression by the British and be humble and be ready to identify themselves by their work, values, morals and what they, as an individual, has achieved not what their great great grand parents did. That pride only feeds you and your family so many meals.
Also, students come to the US and drive cabs which is to be respected but then they drop out and make it a career. I know there are adversities in life but fighting them is more noble and desired for out nation, no matter where they live, than to succumb to it. Desi's are lazy, sorry to say - they should learn from Mexicans and have dignity in work not the prefix of their name (chaudhry, Sardar etc etc). There are some examples of extraordinary achievement but far fewer than needed to command respect and name in the world.
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May 04, 2009 01:42pm
The article addresses a key issue with the Pakistani mentality regarding work ethics, rise to success and financial well being. The class difference renders the affluent useless and they end up being figure heads in Pakistan only with the aid of "Dad and Friends" Since these folks are incapable of achieving success thru hard work, corruption, shady deals becomes the way way of life. The other third life goal is to move to defence and compete wit the affluent. The last segment like me come to America, work thru our Masters degree delivereing Pizza and looking for Researh assistance and finally when we achieve some degree of success, place a major chip on our shoulders of being self made.
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May 04, 2009 01:49pm
These comments are not too far off from the truth. I am a British born and bred of pakistani origin and compared to us locals, the foreign students (no matter where they are from) get away with far too much academically and certainly don't have the financial constraints that home students suffer from. I had 2 jobs during my studies which ranged from working as a waitress in a cafe to being a taxi driver (evening and weekends) just to have enough food to eat and survive.
The foreign students are spoilt and academic institutions in the UK are far too nervous of losing the money they bring to say boo to them. I believe they are judged less rigorously and allowed more leniency when it comes to academic work.
I have worked all over the world and have not been afraid of hard work. This is not a trait applicable to those who always have an option of parent or grand parents bailing them out.
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May 04, 2009 02:01pm
Although there might be some truth in the article it is not really fair to brand the whole Pakistani community as lazy & laidback. Apart from a few rich spoilt brats who come here to have a good time away from under their parents eyes (mind you this lot has been doing that for generations) the average Pakistani Canadian university student here has worked really hard to get to university to begin with, so there is no dearth of ambition there. Most of the students would like to work while at school or during the summer breaks depending on how intense their studies are, the truth of the matter is, it is an uphill task to get a decent job with a Pakistani name. Even though Canada as a country prides itself on being multi cultural, when it comes to hiring it is unfortunately very colour conscious. If you don't believe me try changing your name on your resume & see how many hits you get (speaking from experience). While a high school white person can be a sales manager here, a Pakistani university graduate who has the same work experience will still make twice as little as his white counterpart and will have to be lucky not ambitious or experienced to be a manager here (if in doubt read a whole bunch of articles in Macleans Magazine from April to May). From your article it seems you have landed not too long ago in Canada so, talk about this when you have gone through the grind mill yourself and that will take a while.
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May 04, 2009 02:13pm
Its not only pakistani students, its students from every country and region, 90 percent of the time, students who come from rich families usually dont take things seriously, they dont take up jobs, and work part time.. but it only depends on the person and how they were brought up. its not that they are pakistani that they are like this. some students even if they are well funded end up taking jobs, just to improve their CV's. so it all comes down to the individiual and the family backgroud, not their country.
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May 04, 2009 02:18pm
In this article, there is a reflection of stereotyping about Pakistanis living abroad. The fact is that one can find individuals with good ethics and poor ethics in all ethnic groups. Living in the USA, I have run into some characters that the writer is talking about. However, the silent majority is hard working Pakistanis who are trying to make best of the situation in a foreign land. Same is true for other ethnic groups too.
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May 04, 2009 02:21pm
I don't agree with this article at all. It is based on the author's own interactions.
I recently graduated from a U.S. college and 90%-95% of the Pakistani students had jobs. Some used the money to help with tuition while some used it to help with other expenses (as they were supported by their parents or received full financial aid).
Pakistani students along with Indian students were amongst the brightest and the most high achieving at my college. And those who wanted to find jobs here in the U.S. had job offers even before graduation, despite the economic downturn and a hiring freeze at many of the firms.
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May 04, 2009 02:28pm
I do not agree with the thoughts of author. I have been living in Britian for about 3 years and most of the Pakistani students I have met have a very sensible approach towards the life even if they belong to rich families. First of all it is not possible for a spoiled rich person to get admission in foreign universities. You have to be quite competetive to get into something, secondly most Pakistani's think that the part time jobs will affect their education and they would rather concentrate on their studies rather than working on a utility store. Secondly now a days I have been feeling this sense of responsiblity in Pakistani students that they want to go back to Pakistan and return their learning to Pakistani economy rather than running after the british or canadian citizenship, the way the previous Pakistani generations did.
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May 04, 2009 02:52pm
I believe the survey sample is highly skewed. In my experience, I would say about 5% of the people i come across fall in the category described by the author.
I have an advanced degree in engineering and 15 years of technical and executive management experience. I am also an entrepreneur who founded a successful startup 2 years ago.
When i was in college, i worked at Dairy Queen, gas stations, Little Ceaser, once washed cars, cleaned dishes in the school cafeteria, worked as a tutor, note taker, teaching assistant, and also at poultry packaging plant.
I am extremely proud of the hard work i did and consider it a blessing from Allah.
Ehsan
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May 04, 2009 03:13pm
An extremely inaccurate article. Most Pakistani student are not lazy and not living off their Parents money. Its simply is not possible. Education and cost of living in both Canada and USA is very high even if one live modestly. Most Pakistani families just cant afford to pay it all. Most student from Pakistan works and go to school. This alone is the reason that a majority of Pakistanies who came earlier never finished college because they had to work and survive. Many infact support their families in Pakistan while attending school.
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May 04, 2009 03:14pm
Although I garee with Mr. Farouk's evaluation, I beleiev he has put all Pakistani in one category. Having lived, educated and worked in Canada for over 45 years, I have noticed this new phenomenon among the families who Came to Canada mainly from the Midlle East, who got immigration on the strength of $$$$ they brought. This created an area near Toronto, comnly known as "Bebumpura". Here mothers were manging the broods, while fathers were still making money overseas. I would not blame the kids alone, we the paresnts are responsible for raising them in Canada in a mini-Pakistan. I would say that these parents were trying to satisfy their lack of status in Pakistan. There are children of middle class families who are as good and hard working as the born and raised other Canadian. I see them when I interview and recruit then for summer jobs. I salute them for their dedication and work ethics.
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May 04, 2009 03:36pm
Based on my personal experience at an institute of higher learning here in the US, Pakistani students are very hard working just like students from any other country like China, India, etc. The students help out each other in guiding fellow students during University years and stay in touch during profession years too. Even the ones from the rich families were serious in studies and were hardworking. It was a pleasure to have their company at a time when you are away thousands of miles from your native home. They were the BEST!
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May 04, 2009 04:44pm
Taimoor Farouk's observations and arguments may hold true to Pakistanis in Canada. May be a sizeable (not all) students studying in Canada, hail from affluent families and hence do not need to work. While the argument fits those few it cannot be applied to whole diaspora.Pecularities of the place and individual circumstances bring out varied behaviours.
I am a student at the Australian National University, in canberra. I heard from the faculty members and observed Pakistani students performing very well. However, one may argue that as a pakistani diaspora, we are caught in 'self-denial' and lately face an 'image' problem. On individual level some of us are excellent and others unable to strike study-work-socializing balance. If rightly appreciated may be it is curable.
The strains are considerable on a middle class student abraod from Pakistan. Like retiring debts incurred on visa/travel/study and supporting parents (and relatives) back home.
As diaspora we are not serious community. We are somewhat confused and undecided which place to call home; Pakistan or new found country. Resultantly, nor we are serious to improve the collective lot of place we have left and nor adjust fully to our adopted home. We keep denying the obvious.
Take an example of remittances. Where remittance helps, it spoils many households back in Pakistan. In times of hardships it makes sense that we extend help. But the fact of the matter is most of it is used poorly creating social problems. The youth believes little in hard work, heavy doweries are purchased, big houses are built and the race seems unending and heading nowhere. Huge houses with no permanent residents in Mirpur (AJK), around Dina, Jhelum and Gujar Khan and Gujarat is an illustartion. One thing is conspicously missing: no worthwhile investment in university, hospital and other such human security and uplefting projects despite the 'building affluency' in these areas?
We need to invest in tomorrow's generation. Sadly security of future generations will not improve through plots and building hosues.
I have highlighted few different issues in one breadth. I apologise if it is a bit long.
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May 04, 2009 05:56pm
Taimoor, my son! You have very beautifully analysed the weakness of Pakistani youth. it really needs guts and courage to confess. Now let me do my part. We the elders are equally to be blamed to spoil our brats. We don't allow them to step forward and fumble. We are scared of wrong decisions and their fall outs not realising that a bad decision is ... Read Morefar better than no decision at all.
I was badly feeling this and the guilt was pinching me. So recently, I have conceived the idea of a youth show which has been approved and soon will go on air from PTV Home. It will be totally a youth show where they will be allowed to speak out their grudges, misconceptions, grievances, problems and confusions. Among six seven young people only one elder would be available to face them. May be my guilt would be over like this?
Anyways, your writeup is excellent and don't stop. Keep it up. My du'aa and wishes are always for you.
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May 05, 2009 05:08pm
Before I make my point here, I want to lay out some background so that my views are put in perspective. I am of Indian origin, settled in Canada for the last 10+ years and have friends from the Pakistani background and muslims of Indian background. I can definitely say that Pakistanis in Canada are not a lazy bunch or lack ambition. That is a grossly inaccurate statement. But like their counterparts in the UK and elsewhere, they lag behind Indians in career. The reason why they lag is due to social reason - First, due to large family the attention and resources that each child gets is reduced. I have seen Pakistani kids loitering around in shady corders much more than Indian kids. Such kids are also susceptible to "bad ideas". Pakistani kids are more likely to keep to their community - a forced communal seclusion. They are then unable to integrate properly with the mainstream leading to alienation. This further reinforces any "bad idea" that they might have. The parents who are paranoid about their kids losing their culture, make sure they are more islamicized than their counterparts in Pakistan. When all of this is taken together, it creates a perfect storm for backwardness. In the end, it is not uncommon for these kids to blame the "west" for their lack of opportunities.
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May 05, 2009 07:36pm
Sorry, I dont agree. When I was a student in US, I wished that I did not have to work and could spend more time on my studies. My working part time had no effect on my career at all. Employers dont care if you worked part time at a mall or flipping burgers. If you listen HR folks in major companies then maybe yes, the part time jobs count. But no one cares a bit what those HR people have to say. They are just there to do the paperwork.
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May 06, 2009 01:35pm
Employers care about your grades most of all,and as a bonus an internship, if you graduate from university with excellent grades, you will get a job.
Working at oddjobs while at university is not going to give you any professional experience, and will result in lower grades since a person has to spend the time working, not studying. That is why most students work 20 hours a week while in university, and the ones who work more only do so because they need the money.
A long tenure (6 - 12 months) at a oddjob does look good on a resume, but if it is not there, it is not going to kill your job prospects, if you have good grades.
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May 06, 2009 11:33pm
Expect a few, almost all Paki students in Canada are lazy - and always thinking of 'foreign/white women' and nasty things.
Sounds rude, but believe me, what I wrote above is 100% true. I worked several years in multiple major cities of Canada - and watched and had friendship with hundreds of South Asian students (Indian, Pakistani, Bangladeshi, Nepali, Sri Lankan etc). I found the Pakistani students are more backward thinking, low in character-morality and lazy than the others. Those who wrote that Paki students are 'hard working' etc. etc. have low observation power. I later realized that the Paki students actually reflect the state of society and culture in Pakistan.
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May 10, 2009 12:17pm
One point is missing here. Many Indian students, mainly from middle class, take study loan from banks.All most all banks in India give study loans to meritorious students for studying higher education in both Indian and foreign universities. I am not sure if a Pakistani student has similar bonanza as Islamic banking does not practice study loans. Therefore, it is either highly meritorious or moneyed students can efford study abroad. Today in India,China,Japan and South Korea you find familes are small and parents are over obsessed with the education of their children. This is not possible if a family has many children. Hence the focus of the students get derailed. But basically Pakistanis also are hard working. It is such socio economic factors effect their educational career. There could have been a change in the mind set of western employer after 9/11, and even this may deprive deserving Pakistani students their rightful opportunities.
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May 10, 2009 04:44pm
I am a qualified Human Resource professional and actively engaged in the recruitment industry in the UK for over 5 years. My personal experience says that most of the Pakistani and Indian Graduates are much more hard working and talented as compared to their counterparts. They are highly determined and share the common WILL to excel in their respective fields. Here we have leading surgeons and engineers from Pakistani and Indian origin. More than 10,000 Pakistani students arrive in the UK for university education and their drop out rate is lower than British, Chinese, Indian and Bangladeshis etc.
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May 10, 2009 05:44pm
Well, I cannot speak for all pakistanis in Cannada, or in the US or anywhere else. But I can tell you about one pakistani friend of mine by the name of Sameer who currently works for Dell.
I am an Indian, and have washed countless dishes while I supported myself during my first masters degree. My friend Sameer was right next to me with his sleeves rolled up doing just the same.
My general observation is that there are rotten eggs in every basket. Laziness in my opinion does not know class, religion, race or gender.
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May 10, 2009 07:10pm
The writer is completely write that the majority of Pakistani students are not fit for the work force.
However this is not limited to the elite of Pakistani students here in Canada. Even students belonging to middle class are not ready to work hard and establish a reputation in their respective field of work.
There is a culture of have a soft job where the perks are high and no stress of work. Frankly they are looking for a job where there is no work.
When I opted for working in the private sector instead of government everyone called me stupid. My answer to them was that I want to learn my trade (Being an Engineer)and that is not possible if you work for the government.
I had a friend who was begging me for work. I even offered to train him and offered to proof read his resume. The person got offended by the fact that I offered to review his work before recommending him to my firm.
If this was an isolated case then I would have glaced over it. However this has happened a number of time. People too proud to even take guidence from a fellow Pakistani.
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May 24, 2009 05:39pm
Well one prolem that we Pakistanis have is the fact that we are constantly puttng ourselves down...result of British slavery still continuing on our minds...why are we afraid to move ahead and compete and praise?
Why are we insecure?
I am a Pakistani and very proudly so.
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Jul 19, 2009 09:40pm
Taimur I disagree with your observations. I think your observations may have some application in the GTA area simply due to the socio-economical situation that prevails there. I have studied at the University of Windsor, which was somewhat similar to your observations. However, now being at the University of Alberta (and being the President of the Pakistani Students' Association here) I can assure you that an overwhelming majority of Pakistani students, both permanent residents/citizens and those on study permits, have jobs while they study. I am convinced that the province of Ontario does not have the type of opportunities available in the market for students as does the province of Alberta. So I think you should reconsider the underlying reasons behind the patterns you have observed.
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Nov 05, 2009 03:26pm
A good site with excellent articles. Thanks for such a wonderful informative and entertaining read. Quotations are a great way to inspire you to perform at your best and to remember sage advice from the smartest minds in the world.
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Jan 30, 2010 05:14pm
I came to United States very long time ago. I worked full time while going to School to support myself and my family in Pakistan. In 1960s and 1970s Indian and Pakistani students lived together and socialized with each other. The quality of students those days was very good. We hada purpose to get educated and go back home and serve our country. I think we pretty much graduated from college and got good jobs in America and some of us went back home.
The present geneartion of students are more affluent and from rich families in India and Pakistan. These rich kids are always talking on Cell phones and carrying a laptop and have accounts in Facebook.
The bottom line is both Indian and Pakistani students have done very well in United States. Thanks to good education system in both India and Pakistan the South Asians have been hailed as a Super Minority.
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